Sunday, December 28, 2008

Responding to Recent Comments

Dear friends from India. Your thoughts are interesting examples of how Paul Johnson has brainwashed people into believing he was God's special messenger. You offer no proof for your proposition. In no ways can it be proved that Johnson was God's special prophet except from his own writings. Where is there one instance of something that has come true that was predicted in advance by Johnson? The Bible itself is full of fulfilled prophecy and is internally consistent.

In a previous post, we list factual details of the many things that Johnson predicted in his writings, that did not come true. If what Johnson wrote is to be considered prophecy, then it is FAILED prophecy. If this is the work of God and His wisdom, it is not a God that would be reliable to follow.
"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thorn bushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them." (Matthew 7:15-23)

If we look at the "fruit" of Johnson's work, in many cases we see a trail of hurting people. Many of these people eventually left the group and then are no longer seen by those still in it. Some stayed and struggled through the abuse. Nonetheless, that is the fruit. There are very few stories of truly positively changed lives by the accumumlated knowledge that Johnson "revealed". How could it? A majority of the information is historical and about him. A majority of the people that I know who have left the LHMM, have gone on to lead healthier and more fulfilled lives and never realized the bondage they were under while participating in the LHMM. They have found a true freedom in Christ.

"But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them –- bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up." (2 Peter 2:1-3 NIV).


One Scripture you quote here as proof that the Epiphany works were inspired by God: "For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit." 2 Pet 1:21
I believe this Scripture refers to true prophecy as evidenced in the Bible itself...not the Epiphany or Parousia volumes written by Johnson or Russell.

Then you say that if Pastor Johnson was wrong, King Solomon was also wrong (Proverbs 8:22-31). I'm not following the logic. In this passage Solomon (the writer of Proverbs) is not talking about himself. He is talking about wisdom...and later Paul and John may have alluded to some of these statements to describe Christ's presence at the creation of the world. (Colossians 1:15-17; 2:2, 3; Revelation 3:14)

My heart is not hurt by any of the replies to this blog. I am encouraged to know that there are some that are reading it. I hope that it can help you on your journey in sorting out truth.
"Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world." (1 John 4:1-3 NIV).

17 comments:

Anonymous said...

Hello. Can anyone please recommend a book written in easy to understand language that outlines Pastor Russell s teachings and beliefs. I have difficulty reading the Pastors style of writing as he writes in Studies in the Scriptures. Thanks.

Anonymous said...

Yes ,please contact RalphM.Herzig;webresponse@biblestandard.com by email

Jay W said...

"But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them –- bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up." (2 Peter 2:1-3 NIV).


Does this not apply to your way of worship that you have chosen now?

Anonymous said...

Not sure who that last comment is directed at...but I believe you could argue that the LHMM/Bible Standard group has introduced destructive heresies through their writings. The stories that they have made up could easily refer to those that Johnson wrote concerning types and anti-types where he saw himself. I haven't seen any positive effects of these writings...only ones that have caused divisions and hurt people. Johnson would definitely be among those considered a "false prophet" as he predicted many things based on his Bible interpretations that proved to be untrue as they never came to pass.

Jay W said...

I was wondering how any of us would know who fits 2 Peter 2:1-3
"bringing the way of TRUTH into disrepute,stories made up."
What is the truth that is treated with disgrace?

Anonymous said...

It seems that the posts that quote scripture justify a hatred for LHMM behind words that sound in good character.
It also seems to point to no authority, no direction.
The posts seem to use the Bible as the authority, just with the person writing the post as the authority.
Jesus and the scriptures in total never point to love as the only requirement for true christians.
To recognize being in a false religion or form of worship never excuses joining with another false form of worship, even if the new form of worship is false as well.Mt 7:21-23

Anonymous said...

I struggle with the author when stating that no scriptural backing is given. I can't speak of Johnson, but know Br Russell had abundant scriptural support. What happened to that info? If you had really been part of LHMM you would know that Russell's proof is solid on the basic subjects.

Anonymous said...

I am not affiliated with any of the current "Bible Student" sects, these factions are not the same as the original Bible Students form Pastor Russell's day. Even if I do not support some of Pastor Russell's outdated views, I still appreciate that he was an imperfect man of God, who spent his entire life and wealth in the Lord's service.

Anonymous said...

If you had been on the other side of the "split" of the Watch Tower you might see that Brother Russell believed that truth was in progress. He was the only person willing to really promote it, preach it. As time and study continued, a flaw was found in the 1874 calculation of 100 years. This just marked the 6000 years of human life on the earth, not the Presence

Anonymous said...

A "miscalculation" of 100 years is convenient but doesn't solve the issues in chronology. In the end, what was the change? Does Jesus need to be present to have power and influence change in His Kingdom. It seems arbitrary. If Christ actually returned in 1974, it would have been way more obvious to the majority of Christians looking for and patiently waiting for His return.

Anonymous said...

The same chronology is used to show when the Jews could expect the messiah in the book of Daniel. Sadly most have rejected the chronology in Daniel that points to the end of the Gentile Times. That has not been flawed. Brother Russell stated that he himself was looking for too much in 1914, he was correct in accepting 1914 as the end of the Gentile times.

Anonymous said...

Many thought that 1874 marked 6000 yrs of human life on earth. thaey read too much into that year. It was only 6000 yrs not Christ's return. Later a conflict in translation was realized, and 100 years was seen to be added to bring 6000yrs of human life to October 1975. Nothing more.

Anonymous said...

If you do detailed study on this chronology from multiple sources you will find it is not so simple. I have concluded that the study is interesting but not profitable, practical, or relevant to our lives. One could spend their whole life devoted to finding the right answers and miss out on the main purpose. Here are some interesting articles that overall bring to light the difficulties involved. I'm not saying I agree with them...but trying to follow the arguments involved requires a Phd in several subjects and then many assumptions.

Resolving Chronology of the Second Millennium BC (James Parkinson)
http://www.heraldmag.org/olb/contents/doctrine/chron2m.PDF

Time and Prophecy (David Rice)
http://www.heraldmag.org/olb/contents/doctrine/time.pdf

Jay W said...

I am not sure how the Bible states that we are required to have a Phd. Jesus followers did not attend the schools at that time, they had Jesus guiding them directly and after his resurrection to heaven. They knew when to look for the messiah based in part on chronology.

Anonymous said...

I have made an effort to study chronology. Honestly, for me it comes down to who is Jesus with today. Not who is better. According to the words of Jesus the question actually is who is with him. Who is willing to look to Jehovah and identify who He has been using. He has always used imperfect men, even while using His perfect son on earth.Brother Russell started to find truths that had been scattered throughout religion that had adopted practices condemned thousands of years ago. He was not perfect but he had the evidence of Gods guidance. I do not like pointing at a man. I do feel that the evidence is unavoidable. God is not just letting us wonder through this world ruled by Satan without the benefit of His light that gets brighter, unifying teaching, able to receive support, not confused because of endless debates.

Anonymous said...

Exactly my point. You shouldn't need a Phd. You should just be in a state of "ready"...knowing that He will return and when He does I believe it will be fully obvious. Ever since the first followers of Christ, the thought has been that He could return any moment. That is still true.

Jay W said...

One issue is that Jesus told of a sign of his invisable presence. Again Brother Russell made a point of this, not the first since it had been known for years but hidden in the apostasy. A sign, not coming, that has been noticed but ignored by "christians"
At least ignored by those claiming to be teachers of the people.